Ocean Grove beach. Sunday, July 2, 2017, 3:45 pm. Blogfinger photo. Why is Sunday morning
banned while Sunday afternoon is not?
TO THE EDITOR:
Individuals in charge of opening the OG beach (primarily on Sunday mornings) need to be given some type of plan as to what to do or how to approach the Bradley Beach goers who pay for the Bradley Beach side but then walk over and set up on Ocean Grove. I have witnessed this happen on several occasions.
I was just there yesterday and it was ridiculous, the poor kid who was on duty at the time and making sure he opened up at 12:30 was being attacked for not saying or doing anything to the people sneaking over, meantime all the individuals who paid to get in and were patiently waiting for 12:30 had to stand by and watch others set up and take up space we paid for.
Some of the Ocean Grove payers actually walked over and paid the fee to Bradley beach and stated they wouldn’t come back to Ocean Grove. Those are customers OG is losing out on. A plan needs to be put in place to avoid this from happening again.
FRUSTRATED AT THE BEACH
July, 2017
JESSICA MOLASKEY: Guess where she is.
Well said both Kevin and Ogbess. The solution is simple. If you don’t like the town and its “rules” and “flags,” there are plenty of homes for sale in Asbury, Bradley, Avon, Long Branch, Belmar and other shore communities.
The OGCMA immediately reacted to this situation and put a beach guard on Sundays betweem Bradley Beach and Ocean Grove. Kudos to the Camp Meeting for handling this situation. The money they make from the badges will pay for this employee and more.
The bigger story here is how much beach revenue OG is losing to Bradley every single weekend because they refuse to change the archaic no morning beach rule.
I have been coming to this town for 39 years and have family who are part-time and perm residents. We stopped moving cars out on Sundays years ago, so why is this ridiculous beach rule still in place?
For a father of two young children, I am just going to pay to go to Bradley on Sundays, waiting until 12:30 doesn’t work.
Fat Al, contrary to popular belief, the OGCMA is not the “Methodist Church”. St. Paul’s is the church.
The OGCMA is a corporation with a State charter to operate a “Camp Meeting Ground” in Ocean Grove, “to provide opportunities for spiritual birth, growth and renewal”…for everyone that lives in or visits the town.
Also, you can fly an American flag, a Christian flag, or any other flag on the same flag pole as long as the American flag is the flag on top.
Here is a related sidelight about who owns what:
After Sandy, the Federal government (FEMA) resisted paying for the boardwalk on the grounds that the boardwalk was privately owned (of course the beach underneath it is another story, and the Feds had no problem having the Army Corps of Engineers take care of the beach replenishment as they did for the other towns along the stricken Jersey Shore)
Finally FEMA agreed to pay, because they accepted the notion that the boardwalk was a sort of public asset even though it is privately owned. But they were tight with the funds, and they carved out the pier after saying that they would pay.
On the other hand Seaside Park got many millions to restore their boardwalk and even the shops and amusements after Sandy and again soon after a fire went through.
Neptune Township also was relentless in saying that the CMA owned the boardwalk, so the best they would do was to issue some bonds which had to be paid back as soon as FEMA paid. And, Neptune refused to help with the cleanup at the ocean front including the boardwalk AND the beach on the grounds that those areas are privately owned. So Neptune did, it seems, verify ownership of the beach.
On the other hand Neptune saw to it that they received $1.1 million in Federal GRANTS to rebuild the public marina at Shark River. Supposedly that was 90% of the cost.
So who paid for the rest? Was it Neptune Township with bonds perhaps—interest bearing, with interest coming out of public funds (in part from Ocean Grove tax payers.)
I think the Township should have done more on behalf of the taxpaying citizens of Ocean Grove, just as FEMA did.
And the CMA bravely fought for FEMA payment and they raised (privately) over $1 million, most of which was used for the (public usage) boardwalk; the rest was for the GA roof, Thornley Chapel, and to rehab some of the pier and boardwalk (much of which was done by volunteers) What other Jersey Shore towns raised private money and had an army of volunteers to help?
Why is it so convenient for Grovers to bash the CMA when there is much to appreciate?
This is just another example of favoritism at the Township, with Ocean Grove always getting the short end.—-Paul @Blogfinger
Kevin Chambers – Know that some of us appreciate your dogged determination and dedication. Thank you.
The Sunday beach closing is an OG tradition and is one of those things that makes this town unique. It harkens back to the founding.
Does anyone worry about the effect of religion when the CMA pays for the July 4 parade, numerous free secular concerts, classical music, plays, and fun events for kids?
When Blogfinger needed a venue for its two (secular) film festivals, the CMA offered to pay for it completely and to use their personnel and facilities enabling us to bring student film makers to the Grove from five nearby universities.
Paul, your points are not uncommon reactions to situations like this. But some of the things that you mention highlight the depth of issue. Religious emblems are not “decorations” like any other. A cross (a symbol of a particular set of religions) is not an American flag (a secular symbol of our country). And a private religious organization running a publicly owned facility is not the same as the government running it.
These things are all very different, and those differences are very important. This country was founded in some part by religious refugees, and, indeed, so was Ocean Grove in its own way. One of the bedrock principles that this country does (and should) stand for is that in order for people to be able to freely exercise their own religions (or non-religion), the government may not take actions to establish or prefer a particular religion. That constraint on government provides us all with our own freedom of conscience and choice.
So if the government hands its powers (however small) to a religious organization, it violates the neutrality it must maintain, and implicitly (at least) constrains each of our own ability to freely exercise our own rights. I disagree that there is nothing wrong with the OGCMA running the beach if it is public property, and I disagree that there is nothing wrong with flying a cross flag on public property. If it is not public property that is different, and should be.
And just because churches and other religious institutions provide beneficial services does not mean that we should all be subject to their jurisdiction, on a beach or anywhere else. One does not follow the other.
These issues are very complicated, which is why after two-and-a-half centuries the U.S. Supreme Court is still addressing them (see this year’s ruling on public financing of a church playground resurfacing). But they are important, and, to me at least, the constitutional restrictions are beneficial to all of us, including the religious institutions.
As always, thanks for the forum for discussion.
Cheers.
Al
Fat Al. You said, “The OG beach is under religious control. Hence the cross flag, the wooden crosses, the Sunday morning closure.”
But mostly the beach is managed like any other Jersey Shore beach, and that management has nothing to do with religion. If we exclude the decorations for a moment, that leaves only the Sunday morning closure.but that actually is not a religious matter. You think you know why they close the beach on Sunday morning, but maybe you don’t. Maybe they like the idea of one morning a week when the town can enjoy a few hours of serenity and, as managers of the beach, they can make that policy decision.
And even if the closure is to encourage people to attend church services, do you really believe that people think, “Mmmm, it’s Sunday morning—the beach is closed, let’s go to church?” That seems silly.
No one is being forced to practice Christianity just because the beach is closed on Sunday morning, so your mention of Muslims, Jews, etc is irrelevant. In fact, I have met Grovers, unaffiliated with the CMA, who actually like the idea of a quiet Sunday morning. It’s not like the 19th century when one’s behavior was governed by the CMA including no competitive sports or dancing, or biking, or boating, etc.
There is nothing intrinsically wrong with a religious organization running the beach front, especially when it either owns the beach or has permission from the State to manage the beach. It’s not the same as running the courts or the police dept. Those who run the OG beach have to follow the same Township ordinances that anyone else would have to follow.
In the town where I grew up, St. Mary’s ran a school system. No one ever complained that they were educating some of the town’s students. My only complaint back then was that they were taking some of our most valuable students such as quarterbacks and French horn players.
As for decorations, if you go to any publicly owned building such as a post office, you will find an American flag. If you hate America, are a citizen of another county, and despise the flag, could you argue that the government has no right to fly it at the post office because it offends you? It’s the same as the cross on the beach.
So Fat Al…Let us know if you disagree. We like interesting discussions on Blogfinger, although we do not permit digitally beating something to death. (I know that some of you think that our parking posts are like that, but that topic is the gift that keeps giving.)—-Paul @Blogfinger.net
Frankly, I don’t know if the law permits a municipality to delegate any of its functions to a religious organization. The NJ Supreme Court decision quoted above certainly suggests it does not. A religious organization can own property and can operate it as it sees fit, but OG as a whole is not OGCMA property, it is a municipality (or part of one). That’s why the Neptune police patrol its public streets. So if the beach is private OGCMA property up to the high water line then I guess it is its prerogative what to do with it. I guess the OGCMA could close it to the public entirely, or only open it to particular people of its choosing, I have no idea.
But it certainly does act like it is a public beach much like OG’s neighbors’, and not a private beach club (see for example Phillips Beach and the Deal Casino). One wonders if the beach is on the tax rolls as OGCMA property, or is claimed as exempt by the church. But I kind of doubt it. Instead, it does appear to be public property improperly administered by a religious organization.
And, to be clear, I’m pretty sure that blue laws are fully constitutional (if sometimes unwise or silly) — but only if they are passed and administered by the government.
Cheers.
Al
BethanyB, I did sign the land lease and I knew what I was getting into. But I didn’t know what I was getting into by reading that lease; the lease was totally illegible having been written in script in the 1880s, and photocopied a million times. So my question to you and everyone else is: What does that lease say? I asked my lawyer when I bought the house, a man who went on to be Town Attorney for some years, and he said that he couldn’t read it either and that no one he knew of had created a legible version. I really tried but could not decipher it.
Blogfinger, I’m keenly interested in what would happen if anyone challenged the whole church-owns-the-land setup whether it’s the beach or the lots. I think that this is why they’ve never tried to raise the ground rent.
But Fat Al, when the NJ Supreme Court turned governance over to Neptune in 1980, there was no ruling about the land ownership in Ocean Grove which the CMA continues to claim, and, from their point of view also includes the beach. The court did not demand that the OGCMA turn over control of all the land in town that they own including the beach.
Jack says that the CMA does not own the beach but it has been given the right to manage the beachfront. So whether it owns the beach or has management control, it seems that it is able to rule on beach issues including whether to stay open or closed on Sunday.
Do any of our authorities know if Neptune has supported the CMA in their beach control by way of ordinances?
Dear Surfer,
You say I know history but am unwilling to change it, I have gone to court five times to seek equality in the law for the people of Ocean Grove at my own expense to change the history of the chronic zoning abuse by Neptune Township against OG residents.
Each time the Township, using your tax dollars, has gone to court in violation of law, in contempt of a court order, and in violation of its own zoning to deliberately violate your rights for the benefit of their developer friends.
Each time the Township has violated state mandated parking laws and each time it has created greater congestion on our streets, I have gone to court to fight for your rights that the Township should be protecting, but unlike every other town in this state, the Township instead has sent its tax dollar paid lawyers to argue against your right to the equal protection of the law.
And why is this? It’s because the taxes they drain from OG with each unit they grant in violation of the State parking law benefits the rest of Neptune. So those beach profits you talk about if the beach is turned over to Neptune, will not be used for OG but will go to Neptune and Neptune will continue to rape OG, and our taxes, our town density, and the congestion on our streets will continue to rise.
Kevin Chambers
In response to Mr. Chambers, I will offer this brief quote from the New Jersey Supreme Court: “The Ocean Grove Camp Meeting Association of The United Methodist Church can be delegated neither the power to manage public highways or other public property, the power to make laws, nor the power to enforce Board rules through establishment of a police department and municipal court. These functions must henceforth be exercised by the governing body of Neptune Township, of which Ocean Grove forms a part.”
This is not about leases, it is about governance. The town is not a private club, or a church, it is a municipality. And a municipality can’t establish a religion.
For the “love it or leave it” commenters I would suggest that might also apply to the United States of America. The First Amendment is not only the supreme law of the land, but it is a lot older than the OGCMA.
The State has jurisdiction over any part of the beach “that was ever washed by the tide,” and that includes all of the beach in Ocean Grove up to Ocean Avenue, and the OGCMA manages the beach for the State.
All of the money collected for beach badges is required to be used for the maintenance of the beach (lifeguards, etc.,) and that is done quite nicely by the OGCMA.
That money cannot go into the Neptune Township “General Fund”, no matter who manages the beach.
Love it or leave it folks! I am tired of people moving to town and wanting to change everything. I agree with Kevin; you signed the land lease and you knew what you were buying into.
The beach was closed all day on Sunday when I was growing up….we survived and you will too. Bradley and AP are always an option if you need Sunday morning beach time.
Well said, Kevin Chambers. I also have trouble understanding why people buy in O.G. because of its uniqueness and special feel, and then once they are here, they want to change the very things that created that initial appeal that it had for them.
The OGCMA controls the 4th of July Parade. Should we insist that Neptune take that over too, because the OGCMA is a religious organization?
If people like Chambers never question authority, the rules will not change. He may know history, but he is unwilling to change it. This is as foolish as saying that the US Constitution is the law forever. There were amendments.
Before 1980, there were no cars permitted in OG on Sundays. That was challenged and then changed.
Inasmuch as OG is part of Neptune and we pay high taxes to Neptune, we should insist that Neptune control the beach. This way, all those beach profits can go to town services (as in AP, Belmar, Bradley, etc.) and help keep our taxes down.
In many cases, oceanfront landowners own up to the wet water line, after that it is owned or controlled by the State or Federal Government.
In the case of Ocean Grove, the State Assembly granted the OGCMA control from the water to prevent anyone landing onto OG beaches in the 19th century in perpetuity to protect its Sunday blue laws. So by law the OGCMA can control all of the beach through its water rights to protect its right to keep the beach closed on Sunday.
OG is not a town. It was set up by the OGCMA as a summer camp, though most may not understand that fact. Each leaseholder agreed to the provisions of the lease they signed. That includes following the dictates of the OGCMA’s closing of its beach.
No matter your religion, if you don’t like the rules, you shouldn’t have signed the lease agreeing to abide by the OGCMA rules. Don’t claim you love the community and then demand to change it for your own selfishness.
If you can’t accept the rules you agreed to when signing your lease, then you shouldn’t have bought here. In other words this isn’t the town for you.
Kevin Chambers
If I remember correctly a few years ago there was a fence between BB & OG . Think BB put it up but not sure . Think purpose was to keep each towns beach goers from freeloading on neighboring town .
I myself have no problem with OG beach being closed Sunday mornings. It is part of history & culture of OG . Plenty of other beaches open on Sunday morning. OG probably does lose some $$ however it is not always about $$ .
Policy change in order but remember we are dealing with CMA.
Fair enough re “church.” But the point remains the same: the OG beach is under religious control. Hence the cross flag, the wooden crosses, the Sunday morning closure, etc. For some I imagine that is an upside of the town as a place to live and visit. For me, after 15 years, it was part of the reason it was time to move one town south. It isn’t surprising that some beachgoers have a similar reaction.
With respect to the original letter writer’s concern, there are two ways for the OGCMA to handle the issue if it wants to: it could increase enforcement and throw extra money at enforcing the restriction, or it could recognize that some Christians may want to be on the beach on Sunday morning rather than in church (not to mention the Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, non-believers, et al.) and loosen the restriction.
Cheers.
Al
I agree with Fat Al. OGCMA is already losing money due to an outdated policy. I know many Ocean Grove residents who purchase their seasonal badges in Bradley Beach.
How about starting by putting up a rope with a sign facing Bradley? I often see it where privately owned beaches or beach clubs border public beaches.
Fat Al: The Sunday morning beach closure was part of a compromise to keep a couple of blue laws in effect when Neptune took over governance in 1980. Neptune played ball with the CMA, and they continue to do so—witness the North End Redevelopment Plan. What is the persistent glue that keeps those two together? It seems to be money.
The CMA is technically not “a church”; it is a religious based organization with a Christian mission.
There is some doubt that the CMA owns the beach, although they say that they do. However they at least have been given the right to manage the beach (by the State legislature.) I don’t know if the beach closure is a CMA rule (based on private ownership) or if it is backed up by a Town ordinance.
However, as far as Blogfinger is concerned, this topic is fair game for discussion.
Wonderful place in gorgeous South Jersey called Wildwood. Five miles of beach in all directions with plenty of space between umbrella’s and no beach fees for anyone. Bobby Rydel might even show up to sing his 1963 hit, “Wildwood”. hint, hint.
Maybe OG should reconsider its (absurd — to me) Sunday morning policy, and/or inconvenienced beach goers should choose not to patronize a beach owned and operated by a church.